need help.. wideband voltage not matching romeditor

Hondata installation questions / answers / issues.
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dan.nyc
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Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 10:18 am
Location: ny, ny

need help.. wideband voltage not matching romeditor

Post by dan.nyc »

i just installed the aem uego wideband and am trying to interface it with hondata. with the car not running, the aem output is correct at around 6V but the voltage shows up in romeditor as 3.83V?

I triple checked my wiring and i'm using a dead O2 plug as suggested. 1k ohm across heater wiring, output and signal ground are correct.

could it be a problem in the lamda conversion table? the table goes from 0-5V and the bottom-most cell is blank at zero. i tried it that way and also tried inputting 6v with a corresponding lambda of 1000 just so it's off the chart.

any ideas? any help would be greatly appreciated!

thanks,
dan
b20vtec ek
turbo_civic_si
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Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 5:06 pm

Post by turbo_civic_si »

i am having the same problem. i also made an adjustable 0-5v power supply using a regulated 5v transistor. it still did not read the voltage. i traced it back to different areas of the board to try to see if it will work. it will begin to read the voltage, but then i get an error code for barometric pressure sensor and iat sensor??? haven't came around to messing with it again since i'm sick. but i'm planning on trying another untoched ecu to see if that may help. also, in rom editor, there is an option to disable the o2 heater circuit so you would not need the 1kohm resistor.
dan.nyc
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 10:18 am
Location: ny, ny

Post by dan.nyc »

turbo..

i think i have the solution...

http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=606578

-dan
b20vtec ek
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Hondata
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AEM wideband

Post by Hondata »

A problem with the AEM UEGO is that it's analog output is beyond the range that the Honda ECU input can read, so it can't read above about 14.3:1 A/F (3.8V or so). The only way around this I can see is to make a voltage divider and change the cali8bration, but so far no one has tried this.
Hondata
dan.nyc
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Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 10:18 am
Location: ny, ny

it works!

Post by dan.nyc »

i made the methods black box.. his 'double buffered voltage divider'

cost about 5 bucks in parts.

works like a charm.

-dan
b20vtec ek
methods
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:26 pm

Post by methods »

Again the Methods Black Box is the simple solution. Cost $5 bucks.


HONDATA, If you are going to be the Admin of a technical website, I think you should do more to help your ?customers? than say that you:

?Think there could be a solution but you don?t know if anyone has tried it?

when you know damn well I and others have found the solution and implemented it. You are doing a disservice to your customers by not acknowledging that a solution is available.

I made the solution, here it is. Free of charge.

http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/me ... ONDATA.htm

and here is information on WHY you need to make the change?

http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/me ... facing.htm

If anyone wants this solution but is not confident enough to build it them selves I will make it for you and sell it to you for the cost of the Parts + Shipping + Labor? Which will be around $20.00.

If Hondata wants to sell the boxes, I have the ?footprint? and I can supply 100 of them for a substantial cost savings. All surface mount, packaged and ready for a Hondata sticker.

Motec and FJO are high quality WBO2?s, but for the budget racer, you cannot beat the $400 dollar AEM WBO2.

AND NO, you CAN NOT use the 1V output.


Patrick
4isbetter
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Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:02 pm
Location: gainesville, fl

s200 with PLX m300

Post by 4isbetter »

methods wrote:Again the Methods Black Box is the simple solution. Cost $5 bucks.


HONDATA, If you are going to be the Admin of a technical website, I think you should do more to help your ?customers? than say that you:

?Think there could be a solution but you don?t know if anyone has tried it?

when you know damn well I and others have found the solution and implemented it. You are doing a disservice to your customers by not acknowledging that a solution is available.

I made the solution, here it is. Free of charge.

http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/me ... ONDATA.htm

and here is information on WHY you need to make the change?

http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/me ... facing.htm

If anyone wants this solution but is not confident enough to build it them selves I will make it for you and sell it to you for the cost of the Parts + Shipping + Labor? Which will be around $20.00.

If Hondata wants to sell the boxes, I have the ?footprint? and I can supply 100 of them for a substantial cost savings. All surface mount, packaged and ready for a Hondata sticker.

Motec and FJO are high quality WBO2?s, but for the budget racer, you cannot beat the $400 dollar AEM WBO2.

AND NO, you CAN NOT use the 1V output.


Patrick
Do you know if other widebands have the same problem with the voltage outputs. I planned on wiring the WB in to run on the closed loop instead of the factory O2. I had plans on using the PLX m300. Do you know where i can find information on wiring this up to the hondata.

Thanks

Matt
methods
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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:26 pm

Post by methods »

You need to do your own research.

The Hondata ECU can take 0 ? 3.8V on the O2 input. That I will give you.

Go to the PLX website and look at the graph of their output voltage vs. A/F

You will find that their range falls within the 0-3.8V range. You still need to go and confirm that though to be thorough. Never take the advice of ?some guy? on the internet without a grain of salt.


Let me give you a hint: If you don?t do your own vigorous research in this game called ?Honda tuning? you are going to be playing a new game called ?Honda engine rebuilding?.

I know you are here with the intention of learning, I appreciate that. I congratulate you on your efforts. I am here to tell you it is time to step up your game and think for yourself.

You ask if it can be done? You tell us.

Sorry if I sound snippy, it isn?t you. You are about the 30?th person to ask me that same question in the last year.
:roll:
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Spunkster
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Post by Spunkster »

The reason we do not offer this as a solution is that it is a bandaid fix to AEM's mistake and is not something that we wish to support when users have trouble building it or do not know how to wire it up. A much simpler solution is to purchase the inexpensive PLX wideband which we know works, has narrowband output as well as wideband and has proven itself over and over again.

I see how frustrated you get when everyone asks the same questiion over and over again, so you can see why we try to keep things as simple as posible on our end. We like to use what works right out of the box without having to build something else or modify it to work properly.

Perhaps you should contact AEM about including your black box into thier WBO2 kits. Maybe they would be interested.
methods
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:26 pm

Post by methods »

The above rand that you are responding to is months old. (oct 2003)

I absolutely agree with you though. It is not worth the trouble.


Since then I have contacted AEM (many times) and their new Gauge Style WBO2 is compatible with Hondata. They cut their max output in half.

Thanks for the reply though. I do have an appreciation for how hard it is to distribute a product like Hondata.
kesnut
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Post by kesnut »

i have my PLX using the same ground and live wires on the ECU, and the reading in the hondata is on avg. 1.2 lambda + off
the convtion table has 0 v = 9.998 and 5v =19.998
:?:
methods
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:26 pm

Post by methods »

You arnt making any sense.

First, do you mean A/F or Lambda?

You explained your Table in A/F then you claimed you were off by a factor of 1.2 Lambda. I assume you know the difference?

If you DO mean 1.2 points of A/F (as in you think it should be 12 and it reads 13.2) I will ask how you found this out:

If you did it with a Volt meter let me ask you this:

You checked the voltage at the wires and it was say? 2V. Then what voltage did you see in the software? If it was different, you wired it wrong. If it was the same, you entered the numbers in your conversion table wrong. Easy eh?

IF, on the other hand, you are trying to compare apples and oranges by comparing your WB output to the ouput of say? a WBO2 on a DynoMeter there are just too damn many things that could affect those readings.

Allow me to give you some advice.

Put the car in open loop and idle it.
Read the voltage at the wires. At the same time read the voltage in the software. Do whatever you have to do to make those voltages match (i.e. fix any wiring problems). Then, look up the voltage on the graph at PLX and make sure it matches the A/F in Hondata. Don?t mix up Lambda and A/F. Getting these things to work is not complicated.

So anyway, what was your problem?
kesnut
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Post by kesnut »

u right.. i meant to say AFR:
the AFR reading om the plx VS the romeditor in off by 1.2...
when my PLX is reading 14 the romeditor is reading 12.2
fipracing_com
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Post by fipracing_com »

WHere are you getting power for the PLX and where are you grounding the PLX. The PLX MUST be grounded at the ECU, and the Power should be comming direct from the battery or the fuse box. Use one of the sensor Grounding wires that is comming off the ecu and tap power from a source in the fuse box. I have my M-300 wired in this way and the Hondalogger and Plx read exactly the same readings.
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