Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Civic 2016+ 1.5 Turbo
gtfrede07
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:16 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by gtfrede07 » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:17 pm

Still happening at the shift? I wouldn't worry about it at all.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:57 am

yessir, right after I let my foot off the gas on a healthy pull, seems like when the throttle plate closes I get a knock count.

I won't worry about it for now, ill just monitor it to be safe. I'm still focused on this, not sure what happened, I had it almost perfect:
FULLCOMMUTEstft6.jpg
FULLCOMMUTEstft6.jpg (267.86 KiB) Viewed 772 times
She ran lean as hell this morning, guessing I either over adjusted something or did a - when I was supposed to do a +.

gtfrede07
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:16 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by gtfrede07 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:11 pm

Keep us posted on your findings. That is a very dramatic change from where you had it lol.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 7:42 pm

gtfrede07 wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:11 pm
Keep us posted on your findings. That is a very dramatic change from where you had it lol.
Oh yeah, checking my last save before that I definitely adjusted very incorrectly. I think i brain farted and hit it with a negative adjust in the lower end instead of a positive. I’ll have it fixed over the next few days, heading to VT for the weekend without my car.

NikkoPH
Posts: 34
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:01 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by NikkoPH » Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:34 am

i love how this thread progressed.

Quick question, does the AFM index represent RPM?

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:39 am

NikkoPH wrote:
Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:34 am
i love how this thread progressed.

Quick question, does the AFM index represent RPM?
I think it more represents throttle position, aka how much "air" you are calling for (indirectly, seems like it also takes into consideration how fast you are already going, air density and temp, etc), but for the most part, the more "pinned" my foot is on the pedal the higher the AFMv. value is.

NikkoPH
Posts: 34
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:01 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by NikkoPH » Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:06 am

Thanks, the reason i am asking is since i started calibrating i notice that i have skipped a few values, if i remember the stock AFM calibration shows 3 values per X, ie 1 - 1.50 - 1.75. Not really an in issue but i just wanted to understand this stuff better.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:42 am

08 27 19 ShortTermFuelTrim.jpg
08 27 19 ShortTermFuelTrim.jpg (241.53 KiB) Viewed 716 times
Very close, just trimmed another -3% from 1.3V to 3.3V.

the mean line is a good determination on what to adjust until you get it close to 0, then I think it's best to look at the range of the data points and try to get them evenly surrounding 0%.

Obviously, the perfect mean line would float around 0%, but you also want to make sure you are controlling the extremes.

So let's say after a long datalog, at 2.2V your mean is almost 0%, but datapoints range from -10% to +5%. You would probably want to make the adjustment to try and get that min and max equal deviance from 0%. So you would trim that value to get the extremes close to -7% to +7%.

Not only do you want the mean line to be flat, you want the red blobby scatter to be symmetrical on the 0% line.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:50 am

After I made all the necessary adjustments over the last week, I referred to this graph to make sure the values were smoothed out and the curve was a nice smooth "swoop" .
AFMSmoothing.jpg
AFMSmoothing.jpg (200.78 KiB) Viewed 716 times

After hitting the curve with multiple range adjustments, some of the areas become choppy which I began to feel while accelerating. I did not get a before picture, but above is the after picture. Just look at what value the point that needs adjusting is, and make a gradual number change to the value in the table.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:20 am

Knock count was 16 this morning over 50 min commute, 12 of which were in Cyl #2. Starting to think something is going on and I need to do something about it.

Would adjusting these fuel trims cause knocking to start? Wondering if I should start fresh and reload the canned 6+PSI tune and restart my adjustments to the fuel trim over from square one?

gtfrede07
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:16 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by gtfrede07 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:21 am

They dont state this in the help file so maybe hondata will chime in.... disabling l.trim should allow for a better calibration of the afm based on s.trim only. To me end result is end result but maybe this would improve the methods?

I was under the assumption that zeroing the l.trim limit would kick the cel when it moves off of zero.

It is worded that the trim limits that we can manipulate only limits when the warning code gets thrown....

I have had to "re-baseline" before.

May in fact be a good idea for you....

gtfrede07
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:16 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by gtfrede07 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:27 am

When you re baseline or just for your next upload try one of 2 things.....

Best thing to try would be re-enabling rev hang to see if the counts disappear as it could be the mechanical sound of the throttle plate snapping closed.

OR leave rev hang disabled and make sure to reduce the fuel cut overrun values to 20 or so. I run mine at 15ms for all gears now with the rev hang disabled.

Not bringing the fuel cut overrun values down along with the rev hang disable would cause richness during the shift which may be causing the counts your seeing.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:27 am

gtfrede07 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:21 am
They dont state this in the help file so maybe hondata will chime in.... disabling l.trim should allow for a better calibration of the afm based on s.trim only. To me end result is end result but maybe this would improve the methods?

I was under the assumption that zeroing the l.trim limit would kick the cel when it moves off of zero.

It is worded that the trim limits that we can manipulate only limits when the warning code gets thrown....

I have had to "re-baseline" before.

May in fact be a good idea for you....
Hopefully they chime in, I sent them an email earlier too, but no response yet.

I think maybe I got too nit-picky with the AFR adjustments and and lost the overall "smoothness" of the starting values?

Would adjusting AFRs cause more knocking if I am only getting it closer to the target 14.7?

gtfrede07
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:16 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by gtfrede07 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:55 am

Well from my understanding the afm values tie into what the computer algorithms determine as cylinder fill per stroke. So the short answer would be its possible but in theory if the trims are closing in to 0 and getting better that should be improving the accuracy of that value.

Emount91
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:45 pm

Re: Best Base Map Calib. for New Intake Takeda

Post by Emount91 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:15 pm

gtfrede07 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:55 am
Well from my understanding the afm values tie into what the computer algorithms determine as cylinder fill per stroke. So the short answer would be its possible but in theory if the trims are closing in to 0 and getting better that should be improving the accuracy of that value.
that makes sense.

hmmm, wondering if I should revert back to the base 6+PSI map without fuel trim adjustments to see if the knock count is less or the same. I'm wondering if dialing in fuel trims is yielding more power than the base 6+PSI map and more adjustments need to be made in other places because of it? But I never changed the torque limits so.... i wouldn't think so.

sorry, thinking outloud. Is there a way to tag or @ hondata or spunkster so they can check this thread? I'm assuming they've put it on an ignore list since theres been so much back and forth on it lol.

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