[NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Calibrations for FlashPro Manager - Use all calibrations at your own risk (dyno tuning recommended)

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dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

[NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

!!!1st Post!!!

INTRODUCTION:
Hello Hello fellow Tunerz, I'm Kenichi[22] and reside in SoCal (Southern California), and have been a Honda fanatic for years!
I've owned some powerful Hondas that have been dialed in by dyno and modified to the teeth, but always with the guidance from my uncle since they were his cars. Since his passing I've taken up the idea of tuning myself- I understand the basic concepts of tuning and have been tuning my recent Honda as of 2019.

My Car:
[NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4.
Backstory: Going back to the end of 2021 in December...It was a really terrible week of rain that soaked SoCal Christmas week. I knew that I shouldn't have taken the car out for a drive but did anyways because...Why not? Anyways, what ends up happening is I blow my engine because she ended up sucking up water form a lake that I drove through; not actually but you guys can imagine a terrible dip that was flooded cause of rain water). Flash forward to February with an entirely new engine.

MODS:
_
Engine
.Injen CAI
.Moddified Midpipe
>Stock Resonator
>Vibrant Resonator (Welded)
.Skunk2 Axleback
.Hondata FLASHPRO
-essentially an intake and exhaust-
-more to come ;)-
_
Exterior
BC Coilovers
Tires And Rims

ISSUE:
RUNNING TOO RICH ( negative 20s-30)
MINOR KNOCKS(9-15)

My Knowledge Thus Far on the topic:
.So I ended up taking the car back to my mechanic guy, said that everything was tight and sealed correctly when he re-checked his engine drop job.
.Possibly faulty Bank 1 O2 Sensor?
.Tried other base map tunes but to no avail
.Watched Evans Tuning and other Tuning Videos on Youtube for knowledge

What I've Tuned:
So my prior tune was based off the Hondata Reflash Base Map
>Disabled Rev Hang
>Attempted Vtec Crossover L:4200/U:4200 RPM
>Idle set @1000rpm
>Heavily altered Cam Angles for both lower and upper

CONCLUSION:
Will be uploading some Data Logs with pictures of various tables needed soon, as well as pictures of the build. I look forward to any assistance and would love to call or discord on tuning things. (:) )

支援をありがとうございました!!!
(Thank You!!),

Kenichi

P.S. Please pm ASAP, I'm currently working as i post this so I can't check all the time :(
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

Once you're able to post the datalog and calibration we can see what you're working with. From what you say it seems like a simple fix, but if there is a mechanical issue of some sort that would hinder the abilities to tune it right. But when you can, post the datalogs and the calibration you're on so we can look it over.
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

Back with some Data Logs!
Few things before taking a glance at the logs.
>Will be Uploaded in a 2 Step Reply because of Attachment limitations
>Traction Control was On
>I was by myself so I apologize for lacking accuracy when attempting to record.
>I'm knocking mostly in cylinder 3
Attachments
5. Regular Driving (On-Local).fpdl
(2.31 MiB) Downloaded 80 times
4. Stop N Go 1.fpdl
(551.76 KiB) Downloaded 65 times
3. Small Pull 3.fpdl
(194.92 KiB) Downloaded 76 times
2. Small Pull 2.fpdl
(164.19 KiB) Downloaded 74 times
1.Initial.fpdl
(934.25 KiB) Downloaded 69 times
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

DATA LOGS Part II:
Current Tune That is on Vehicle Included.

Thanks again for the Help! Pointers are also greatly appreciated.
Attachments
Cuztom Tune.fpcal
(20.02 KiB) Downloaded 71 times
9. Final.fpdl
(1.97 MiB) Downloaded 70 times
8. Straight Pull 2.fpdl
(177.66 KiB) Downloaded 72 times
7. Straight Pull.fpdl
(74.86 KiB) Downloaded 63 times
6. Stop n Go 2.fpdl
(1.43 MiB) Downloaded 72 times
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

So a few things on the datalogs, the main thing I see is the fuel is very rich at idle. That needs to be addressed along with the overall rich conditions while driving too. The knock seems very minor and can easily be removed. Being that you're in California, so I'm guessing you're running 91 octane.

For the calibration you're running, a few questions I have and in no specific order...

-How did you determine your cam angle mapping?

-Your rev limit is set way too high, I hope you haven't attempted to hit 8500 rpm on a 9th gen engine, the limiter should be set to a max of 7600 rpm for a 9th gen with stock oil pump.

-Have you scaled the MAF for proper fueling, or is the MAF scale how it was in the basemap? Looking at the curve of the MAF scale I would say you haven't, but I'm curious.

There are a few other things I would look into changing in the tune. These are my main questions at the moment. I would also consider tuning it speed density the intake you have, but we can discuss that later. Right now it's MAF based which might not be the best option moving forward.

Are you wanting to continue moving forward with this calibration, or are you open to starting on a new basemap with all of the presets already done and you can focus on tuning it straightforward?
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

Thanks so much for the timely responses I greatly appreciate the help.
BTW Also on a Stage 1.5 Clutch no light weight fly-wheel


>Yes Correct I am running 91 Octane-I wasn't running too rich before i have no clue as to seeing that i replaced injectors with stock ones.

>I've taken tuning advice from various sources: Evans Performance Academy, BD Alchemist's Introductory video to Tuning, Various posts here as well as 9th Gen Civic forums, actually reading the HELP tab that comes with Hondata FlashPro, with what I know and learnt from my Uncle. Whether I applied those principals correctly-I have no clue.

>As for my Rev Limit being @ 8500 RPMs- that's because I was editing some things and forgot to replace the value- previously I was @6000.

>I've taken a look at the different tables and did minor things (add or subtract 1% or 2%//OR// Ctrl + D & Ctrl + I). I'm familiar with the term "speed density" and have looked into this route as a tuning option.

>I thought about it but don't quite grasp the concepts of fuel. Respectfully, I'd like to keep both tunes but if it's best to restart-I'm all ears!. Thank you again so much!
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

It's really hard to get a base calibration that is dialed for all cars, so most of the maps are just a starting point to getting you going. If you're rich after uploading a map, you just need to go in and make adjustments to bring it back. Rarely is too much fuel a fuel injector issue. So replacing the injectors shouldn't have been necessary. 

So the next step would be to look into scaling the MAF sensor, you will want to find tutorials on that so that you understand how to do it and how to work to keep the MAF scale nice and linear. You don't want it to be super choppy and very choppy. If your intake is causing a poor MAF reading, you will want to transfer to the speed density strategy then so you can tune it using the MAP sensor. If nothing else, I would highly recommend swapping to a hybrid calibration at the very least so that you can tune WOT fuel using the MAP sensor and the MAF sensor for part throttle. The hybrid calibration allows you to fine tune the WOT fueling, while allowing the MAF sensor to control part throttle. First thing though would be to really determine whether or not the MAF sensor is getting a good reading or not. If you find it hard to scale the MAF sensor efficiently, I would say the MAF isn't getting a good reading. Which is why switching to a complete speed density tune is the best option in my opinion for your setup, but you can try the MAF or hybrid calibrations if you want to. 

I'm not sure which tables you're adding or subtracting 1% or 2%, being MAF tuned it all needs to be done in the MAF scaling. Right now your idle fuel trims are short term -14% and long term -15%, you will need to make more than 2% changes to get it inline. Because of that extreme fuel issue at idle, your normal fuel trims aren't too bad which makes me think you're not getting a good reading on the MAF sensor from your intake, then again the commanded AFR is hunting so that throws things off a bit. Switching to a speed density calibration would allow you to control all of that through the fuel tables directly and bypass all the MAF scaling. 

Another thing I would highly recommend, while you're learning, make both the low cam and high cam tables all 0*. That would allow you to fine tune the 0* cam angle with a lot less moving parts. Once you have the tables as you want them, you copy and paste the 0* cam angle maps into the 15*. Tune the 15* as you want it, then copy that into the 30* and tune that. Once you have the 0* cam as you want it, you really just copy and paste up to the next cam angle as you're going and that gives you a stencil to work with. When you're tuning all cam angles at once, it's very difficult to get them all dialed. 
As for your current cam angle mapping, at the 6000 rpm on the low cam you want to start brining the cam angle back down. I see you've made a lot of changes to the rpm breakpoints. Your high cam you have running essentially one cam angle throughout, which will cause you to lose some top end power. The cam angel will need to rotate less as you get to redline to make the most power. When you tune each cam angle, you can then use all that data to build a cam angle map and decide on a vtec rpm. 

To conclude, if I had to give you one tip to make the next move, set all the cam angles to 0* and work to fine tune that 0* cam angle in totality. Work on that 0* cam angle and then post a datalog if you want some tips on it. If you want my help at any point just let me know. There are so many settings to change in the background to make it act a certain way which is why I asked if you wanted a basemap to start on with all the background stuff set.
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

Good Day,

Thanks again for the input EFICU I had little to some idea of where to go with my current base map but was stuck at the fact that I was not able to figure out the reason as to why I'm Running Rich. I knew there were more complexities that I didn't understand when it came to MAF vs MAP vs Fuel Tables and the whole 9 yards... So that was my primary reasoning behind getting some Veteran-Advice from anybody. I really wanna get this tune perfected without taking to an actual dyno.

My Verdict:
I will take your advice and redo my current base map with everything you've mentioned in mind. I'll do some more research on tuning from cam angle 0* and if I need more guidance I'll reach out again via PM or this Forum. I've barely brushed surface of tuning and I appreciate your input.

Finally, I would also like a basemap that you've produced to start with if possible...
Thanks in advance, currently at work but wanna get a datalog of a tune that is more in line with my set up while driving home.
I'd like to go the route mentioned Speed Density. But will do more research on Hybrid and MAF tunes.
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

Sounds good, yeah look it over and see what you can come up with. Attached is a base file for you to get started with. It's from a car with the Injen intake, and it's speed density based. If you need help setting the cam angle map to 0* or anything like that, just let me know. All of the settings are done in the background, so you can use this one without any issue to start.

Some other things I noticed in your other calibration, you don't want to set your cooling fans to come on at 160*. That's way too low. And the idle speed settings, you want to keep the RPM higher in colder temps so it starts easier and warms up faster. Granted it doesn't get cold in SoCal, but if you go to the snow or something at below freezing, it won't like to start at 1000rpm and will take a long time to warm up. So try leaving those settings as I have them in this file, but if you want to change them you can, it is your car, just trying to help.

Anyways, see what you think. Hopefully it gets you in the ballpark and you can tweak it as you wish from there.
dtkktd.SD.Rev01 (Vtec4500).fpcal
(22.57 KiB) Downloaded 98 times
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

!!!~I appreciate it very very much~!!!

>I will slowly alter the previous base map (the one that I currently have tuned aka my tune)
>I'll put your base map to the test on my drive home- it takes me approximately 1 hr to drive home so hopefully I'm able to get some decent charts with out the lengthy uploads.
>I have so many questions for you like:
.What platform do you prefer to tune the most and why?
.What do you currently own and tune?
.How long have you been doing this?
.Where are you based?
.Speed Density vs Hybrid vs MAF tunes?
.And Many More
>Should I make a new post or continue to thread this one?

I really thank you for taking your time to assist a noobie and hope luck comes around for you.

P.S.- What's your take on Evan's Tuning Paid-Class and other things of that sort.

Sincerely, Kenichi Dang
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

You're welcome. Yeah see how the basemap I sent you goes and see what you think. If you're entirely committed to learning a lot of the background information, then yeah you can go back to your previous calibration to play with things. If you just want to learn the fuel and ignition tuning then my basemap would be the best moving forward as the background settings are already provided.

Favorite platform to tune is the 8th gen, FN2s, anything with 8th gen architecture I enjoy a lot. 9th gens are a close second, they are just a little more quirky with the stock intake manifold so chasing some things in the tune takes a little more work. But the 8th and 9ths are my favorite. I do a little S2000 stuff, but newer boosted generations I don't do. I can help guys get out of unsafe conditions, but I don't enjoy the platform. It's all algorithm based for ignition and a few other things.

I've been admiring the tuning industry for at least 20 years. I know, and admired one of the best Ford tuners in the country for almost 20 years now who got me interested in tuning. As far as the west coast goes, he is the premiere Ford tuner and is now fairly well known nationwide with new platforms that allow Fords to be remote tuned. Seeing him work on 03/04 Mustang Cobras back in the day was fun to watch. Back then 500whp was a big deal, not it's nothing to be excited about in the V8 world. Granted, a 500whp Civic is amazing, but in the V8 world, 500whp doesn't excite people like it did 15-20 years ago.

If you move forward with my calibration, I would stay focused on speed density tuning. With the intake you have, I think that is the best move going forward. If you want to stick to your tune, I would look into hybrid calibrations. I can set your file up to be a hybrid calibration if you want. It's straightforward to do, but you have to be ready to tune the fuel tables and scale the MAF. With your intake though, scaling the MAF may be difficult, and since you're new to tuning, you may keep adjusting with no results because of that poor reading. But either way, I can try to help you out as you go.

Don't make a new post, Hondata likes for information to be flowing on the forum and not scattered over many threads. There might be a guy in five years in your same scenario and this thread may help him. That's their goal with the forum as a whole.

Evan's Tuning is great. I've seen his videos and I believe he outlines things as they are supposed to be in the videos. If you watch his videos, he outlines tuning the 0* cam angle as your first step in the tune and I can't stress that importance enough, just as Hondata does. Having it on the 0* cam angle means there are no moving parts or anything going on and you can focus on one sheet of paper essentially. Imagine trying to proofread 10 pages at one time, it's impossible, proofreading one page or cam angle at a time is much easier to do. It all depends on how detailed you want to be and how much you care about the product you build for yourself or provide to others. For me, I am always trying to provide the best product for people. Part of that comes from the Ford tuner I know, he is truly a master and one of the best Ford builders and tuners in the country.

But yeah, just keep this thread going when you have a question or whatever you plan in the future. The main thing is don't psych yourself out. Hondata has built an extremely user-friendly platform, and once you get the hang of it you will laugh at the things you used to be scared of. I remember the days I first looked at a Hondata datalog and wondered what I was looking at, now I realize I was overthinking things and now it's so straightforward it's funny to me. So stick with it, and don't get discouraged.
Kenja
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat May 28, 2022 8:35 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by Kenja »

EFICU wrote: Fri Feb 25, 2022 12:44 pm You're welcome. Yeah see how the basemap I sent you goes and see what you think. If you're entirely committed to learning a lot of the background information, then yeah you can go back to your previous calibration to play with things. If you just want to learn the fuel and ignition tuning then my basemap would be the best moving forward as the background settings are already provided.

Favorite platform to tune is the 8th gen, FN2s, anything with 8th gen architecture I enjoy a lot. 9th gens are a close second, they are just a little more quirky with the stock intake manifold so chasing some things in the tune takes a little more work. But the 8th and 9ths are my favorite. I do a little S2000 stuff, but newer boosted generations I don't do. I can help guys get out of unsafe conditions, but I don't enjoy the platform. It's all algorithm based for ignition and a few other things.

I've been admiring the tuning industry for at least 20 years. I know, and admired one of the best Ford tuners in the country for almost 20 years now who got me interested in tuning. As far as the west coast goes, he is the premiere Ford tuner and is now fairly well known nationwide with new platforms that allow Fords to be remote tuned. Seeing him work on 03/04 Mustang Cobras back in the day was fun to watch. Back then 500whp was a big deal, not it's nothing to be excited about in the V8 world. Granted, a 500whp Civic is amazing, but in the V8 world, 500whp doesn't excite people like it did 15-20 years ago.

If you move forward with my calibration, I would stay focused on speed density tuning. With the intake you have, I think that is the best move going forward. If you want to stick to your tune, I would look into hybrid calibrations. I can set your file up to be a hybrid calibration if you want. It's straightforward to do, but you have to be ready to tune the fuel tables and scale the MAF. With your intake though, scaling the MAF may be difficult, and since you're new to tuning, you may keep adjusting with no results because of that poor reading. But either way, I can try to help you out as you go.

Don't make a new post, Hondata likes for information to be flowing on the forum and not scattered over many threads. There might be a guy in five years in your same scenario and this thread may help him. That's their goal with the forum as a whole.

Evan's Tuning is great. I've seen his videos and I believe he outlines things as they are supposed to be in the videos. If you watch his videos, he outlines tuning the 0* cam angle as your first step in the tune and I can't stress that importance enough, just as Hondata does. Having it on the 0* cam angle means there are no moving parts or anything going on and you can focus on one sheet of paper essentially. Imagine trying to proofread 10 pages at one time, it's impossible, proofreading one page or cam angle at a time is much easier to do. It all depends on how detailed you want to be and how much you care about the product you build for yourself or provide to others. For me, I am always trying to provide the best product for people. Part of that comes from the Ford tuner I know, he is truly a master and one of the best Ford builders and tuners in the country.

But yeah, just keep this thread going when you have a question or whatever you plan in the future. The main thing is don't psych yourself out. Hondata has built an extremely user-friendly platform, and once you get the hang of it you will laugh at the things you used to be scared of. I remember the days I first looked at a Hondata datalog and wondered what I was looking at, now I realize I was overthinking things and now it's so straightforward it's funny to me. So stick with it, and don't get discouraged.
Hey I like that you kept this thread alive! I’m in need of some assistance. Are you able/willing to look at what I have going on
EFICU
Posts: 3295
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:14 pm

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by EFICU »

Depends on what you have going on, there are some setups I don't do. Go ahead and start your own thread and give us some more context on your setup and future plans. Then we can go from there.
dtkktd
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:20 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: [NA] 2015 Honda Civic Si FG4-Tune Request

Post by dtkktd »

Side Note: I had made another Post!! Sorry about that~ but I felt like it was appropriate- please follow up if anyone can!
支援をありがとうございました!!!

私の決意は提供されます

Kenichi Dang
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